“Paul, Your statement on Burns ref cruelty has been around along time it was nothing more than damage limitation; it was as daft 9 years ago as it is now.

The truth, Burns did try and investigate cruelty and asked for the evidence to be presented, Get this the LACs turn up with paper cuttings, once Burns had picked himself off the floor from laughing he advised them this is a government enquiry and unsubstantiated nonsense is not required and to bring back harder evidence, this the League agreed to do, but surprise surprise never showed up with it.

Step forward the RSPCA they claimed for sometime to have scientific proof from a paper written by Prof Stephen Harris, a sure fire winner. Unfortunately Prof Harris forgot to tell the RSPCA he had got his scientific evidence from an animal rights website in America that had twisted original research to suit there argument. This only came to light at the enquiry. Burns was then forced to admit there is no verifiable data to reach a view on cruelty.”

“Giles, the only natural predator of foxes in Britain is the Golden Eagle.
This then begs the question; if as you claim, fox-hunting mimics natural predation, why does the hunt ride horses and not giant birds?”

“Giles, you seem to have missed quite a few points along the way.

Burns wasn't set up to compare the cruelty of hunting with others forms of killing animals - in fact it wasn't even in the remit of the inquiry to determine whether hunting is cruel or not. Nevertheless, it still concluded that hunting 'seriously compromises' the welfare of hunted animals. It is therefore an animal welfare issue, and animal cruelty for fun can never be justified.”

“Nick Singer brings up the ususual argument that the hunt ban is about bigotry, envy, pejudice etc.

The only reason that hunting was not banned along with other blood sports years ago was because the lawmakers and enforcers were hunters so misused their positions to maintain their own 'sport'.
The latest legislation has merely redressed this balance.

Ignorance is clearly evident on both sides.

I welcome the Tory stance on hunting - to paraphrase, you can have a free vote and as much parliamentary time as we need until you vote to repeal it - and the more public they make this the less likely is their election.
This is no bad thing.”

“Paul the point you are missing is that any form of wild animal control seriously compromises the welfare of the subjects of the control.

If wild animals are going to be controlled then the issue is what form of control is preferable.

The Burns inquiry did not find that hunting was any crueller than any other form of control. Indeed in some circumstances it found it was preferable.

This was before peer reviewed research on the effects of shooting on foxes added considerable weight to the arguments in favour of hunting.”